Viral horror - the Nick Berg tragedy

🚀 This week on T minus 20, we rewind to headline-grabbing news, ethical media dilemmas, unforgettable pop hits and pivotal sports triumphs.

🎬 We kick off with a dark chapter in modern history, revisiting the tragic fate of Nick Berg, whose brutal demise at the hands of extremists left the world reeling. This heart-wrenching story isn't just a reflection on the perils faced in conflict zones but also sparks a conversation on the ethics of media in the digital age. How far is too far when sharing the truth?

📰 In a twist of media fate, we dial into the controversy that saw Piers Morgan stepping down from the Daily Mirror over fabricated photos of Iraqi prisoner abuse. A stark reminder of the thin line between sensationalism and integrity in journalism—decades on, are we any better at spotting the fakes?

🎶 Switching gears to lighter vibes, we're cranking up the hits - from Maroon 5's 'This Love' to Usher ruling the charts. Plus, a nod to Killswitch Engage's 'The End of Heartache,' pumping fierce energy into metalheads' hearts and the airwaves alike.

🏆 Sports fans, we haven't forgotten you! Revel in nostalgia as we recap the Laureus World Sports Awards, where legends like Michael Schumacher and Annika Sörenstam took top honors.

🌍 And who could forget the Eurovision spectacle? With Ukraine's electrifying win with "Wild Dances," we’re diving deep into the cultural and musical legacy of this iconic competition.

🎥 On the movie front, 'Van Helsing' was slashing through cinemas, but was it a hit or a miss? We dissect this monster mash-up and its impact on the horror genre.

📺 Lastly, pour one out for 'Frasier' as we revisit its grand finale. After 11 seasons, did it deliver the send-off it deserved?

📚 And for our bookworms, we delve into Bob Woodward's 'Plan of Attack,' offering a piercing look into the corridors of power during a pivotal time in American and global politics.

Ready to rewind? Join us on T minus 20, where the past is always present! 🎙️✨ #NostalgiaTrip #PopCultureRewind #Tminus20

Hang with us on socials to chat more noughties nostalgia - Facebook (@tminus20) or Instagram (tminus20podcast). You can also contact us there if you want to be a part of the show.

Transcript

Transcript is generated automatically

The year is 2004. Your polyphonic ringtone habit is sending you broke. George W Bush is sworn in for a second term, and in spite of everything going on, the most controversial thing is a wardrobe malfunction at the Super Bowl. T -, 20 rewind 20 years with Joe and Mel. 

Week of Nine May 2004. 

20 the rest is. 

History. Stop trying to make fetch happen. What? I'm very forgetful. 

You guys, what are we waiting for? 

It's harder than I thought it would be. 

My fellow Americans. Let's roll. 

Welcome to team owners 20. We're rewinding 20 years, dissecting the week's news, entertainment, music, tech, and trends. I was gonna say it would have had you glued to your Nokia or your Motorola razor, but it would have actually just had you talking to your friends. Cause there was ****** all you could do on your mobile phone back then except for make phone calls. Now, whether you're an 80s or a 90s kid craving A nostalgic trip down memory lane or just a Y2K curious Gen Y or Z, discovering the quirks of the past, wondering what mum and Dad got up. Two 2 -, 20 is your weekly ticket to a wild wild ride through the time vortex with your host Joe and Mel. 

Hello, Mel. Hello, everyone. And the vortex is gonna spew us out at the 9th of May 2004. That's what we're. Looking at this week. 

Yeah. And there's nothing like being spewed out in a time vortex and having to hear this sort of stuff. 

Zarqawi killed my son, and he looked at him. Zakat. Zarqawi felt my son's breath on his hand as he held the knife. 

That is a very, very graphic crime that was committed. It was a, it was a terrorist act, actually, this time 20 years ago that had everybody on the Internet for all the wrong reasons. 

I got fired but I didn't believe half of the. Stuff that was being said about the but the the circumstances behind my departure, I've never accepted necessarily those pictures were fake. 

Was Piers Morgan? 

Getting fired again, he's always getting fired. That guy's me. He's getting yes interesting character. 

Yeah, it always seems to. Bounce back though it's a. Shame. Like he, he's. Never going away. They tried to get rid of him in 2004. They're still trying to. 

Get rid of him now. Well, as you might have heard by now, we've reached the point where we're stepping down from our. Cheers. How can you step down from chairs? 

Yeah, I agree. How can you step down from cheers? That's some other people that lost their job this time 20 years ago that I actually adored. I was a huge fan of this duo, and it was almost the end of an era. They did move on to bigger and better things, I think. Well, they moved on to other things. I don't know. They moved on to another. 

Hmm, good points. Yeah, in the video. 

Network. OK, but. Huge fan of them and is one of the reasons why I just love watching movies to this day. 

Yeah. 

All of that and more tonight on team Miners 20 or today or this morning or this afternoon or on the way to the school, pick up or whatever it is, maybe just especially with some of the news stories we've got. Actually this week, maybe just your ***** for the kids this week. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, you're looking fabulous, Mel. 

Yes, good morning. Oh, thank you. 

I noticed you've done something with your hair. 

Well done. Thank you. I have. I've got. 

I know. 

Banged I've. 

You've got. I like your bangs. 

Not a fringe. Well, I was. We're at a religious event. A few weeks ago. And it was going for a while. And look, any event, anything more than about 45 minutes, my mind starts to wander. And I was just sitting there and I just started thinking. And I was like, yeah, the forehead creases are getting a bit deep. And I was like, do I want do? 

I want this. 

Because. 

Botox cause like you can just go get that done in your lunch break. Everyone's doing. It's kind of socially acceptable. Do I wanna do that? I don't know. I don't think I'm quite ready for that. And then I went hang on a. 

And I thought, no, I. 

If I cut a fringe that covers them up, that makes them disappear so well then I then I got a sign. I got a message, a text message reminding me of my hair appointment. So I'd like to think it was. It was a sign from. 

Right. Take your thanks. Uh. 

Above it, it's really. 

Ohh, while you're at the religious event, the text message came in. 

Just. Yes. Reminder, you've got a hairdresser and I was like that. If that's not a sign. 

You received the call. 

Getting getting, getting bangs across to the. 

Save. 

Ohh. 

And I asked my head cause normally hairdressers say no, they normally flat out. Yes, it's a thing. It's a thing. Every hairdresser I've ever had. Whenever I say for the no, I'm not doing that. No, no, you're not having that. 

Two friends. Uh-huh. Cause you know some heavy metal haircuts back in the 80s back in the 80s like you'd have, like blokes with long hair in heavy metal bands and then you'd have the occasional ones that would cut a fringe. 

Hmm. 

Like Bruce Dickinson from Iron Maiden. 

Really. He he he does actually, because I'm struggling to think of any cause. It was bandanas and then the. 

Yeah, he was notorious. 

Hair would just go over. 

Yeah, Bruce, Bruce had a fringe. Yeah, he had bangs. Yeah, that was good. It's not as good as yours. 

The top. So yes, that's a good point, yeah. But they were close. Well, every time, like I've only ever had a fringe, probably three or four other times. It's always been when my hairdresser's been sick or being away and I've had a replacement hairdresser. So. 

Right. You just like, say you just gonna go for it. 

I. Can get away with it. I'm like, I'd just say, well, they said I could. They were gonna do the fringe this time, so. 

A trick. 

Them. So normally hairdressers say no. 

Your hairdresser forbids you from getting a. 

Fringe. Well, I thought. I thought my current hairdresser. Would cause I. Was like I've got the sign. 

Yeah. 

I'm gonna go in, and I'm gonna ask and see what's. 

I saw the sign. 

Gonna happen. And I got in and I asked and he's like, you know what, I thought you were gonna ask that. I had a feeling that you. 

Yeah. Really, you're gonna ask for fringe? 

Were. That, and I was like, so what's your answer? 

Was he at the same religious? Event that you were at. 

Maybe I don't know. Maybe he was also enlightened. He's like I I had a feeling that you were gonna ask me for that. And then he says before I answer the question, can I just ask you a question, right. Yeah. 

My God. Wow. 

Are you OK? Is everything alright? 

Are you OK? 

Is like I before. I agree to this. I just wanna make sure that you're not going through any significant transitions midlife crises. 

Too late for midnight. 

Are you getting a divorce? Because because often people do drastic things with their hair. 

Oh my God, I hope not. 

At certain points in their life. So. He thought he's. Like I just wanna make sure you're OK. 

You've got a fringe. It's not that. 

Drastic. Well, he just wanted to make sure he just wanted to make sure duty of care. Be sure he does something. So yeah, so significant. And I said no. Look, see, here's, here's Joe. He's doing handyman projects. He's sent me a photo. We're good. We're good. He's like, OK. 

Right. OK. 

MHM. 

Ohh proof of proof of relationship. Yeah. Proof of husband, yeah. 

Proof of. So it's gone. No worries. Let me get the iPad and we'll check out some fringes. So he was fine with that then. 

Right. 

You picked fringes on the iPad. 

Yeah, he's. 

You're like, I'll have that one. 

He just goes hold on a minute. I'll get the iPad and we'll look at fringes. It was an interesting conversation. 

Right. 

What was the fringe code that you picked? 

It didn't have a name. It didn't have a name. I do feel like those dogs that have no eyes on Bluey, that bought the house because it does kind of go over my eyes a little bit. I feel a little bit. What are they? What are they? The Dulux dogs feel a bit sheep doggish but no, he he agreed to it. He wanted to do something small though he's like. 

Was it like Ralph, you know, like the dogs in the cartoons? Like mourning frank? Mourning Ralph was like that. Yeah, one of those dogs, yeah. 

Let's just go with curtain bangs. And I was like, I'm going all in, mate. Like, just cut, cut all the way. Like, halfway back in my your curtain. 

Curtain bang. 

Things are like you want to get bangs, but you don't wanna commit, because then you can just like park them to the side and kind of blend them in. I'm like, no, no, we're going to go full full bang, but then so we agree to this and then he's, you know, doing the toner and rinsing my hair. He's like, oh, I I need to move you so often. What happens at the hairdressers is you sit, you sit at one bit. 

Right. Yeah, yeah. 

Uh-huh. Yeah. 

You get your colour done, you get the rinse and then you move somewhere else for the cup. So it's like I'm just going to move you. 

Right. 

I've. Moved your stuff. We're just going to sit over here and he's like I've got you. I've got you some magazines ready to go. I sit down and it was a pile of women's weeklies. 

Yeah. Relocation for the cut. 

So he clearly thinks I've gone through something and I'm out the other end. 

Ohh alright. 

There's a stack of women's weekly. Who was it? Who was always on the cover of women's. 

Yeah. 

Weekly. 

Maggie tabra yeah. 

Yes. And who was that other one? Lauren Hutton. Lauren Hutton? Yes. Great recipes. Oh, yes. Yes, some good recipes. 

I don't know. Lauren Hutton. Yeah, yeah. Fiona MacDonald. Every now and then. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So he thought the only bangs she's ever getting now is a fringe. That's the stage of life she's at. Little does he know. That might have been a bit preemptive, but you know you've you've gotta put it out there, especially at this stage in our relationship anyway. It's so for the hatches, matches and dispatches. Clue. We have the hatches, matches and dispatchers segment at the end of the programme. You know how it works. And we play a little clue at the beginning. Just to kind of hook you through. It's a this one. This one is a celebrity. A couple of celebrities, actually, it's a match. We have a match, a bunch of. Well, not a bunch because that's like, polygamous and that's illegal in some places. It's just two. The couple, who are getting married this time 20 years ago. 

It was perhaps half an hour or or so later that someone came up to me and said, do you? Know who these people are. And said no, and then we found. That. 

Do you know who these people are? We'll find out who those people are at the end of the programme. 

Do you? 

As always, it's news time and we'll kick off on the 11th of May. I remember this story so so well. I think this was the first time I had witnessed somebody dying on the Internet in real life in a very brutal fashion. This is not for the faint hearted, this story. So if you've got little ears around maybe. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Save it for another time. We'll skip forward to the next chapter, Nick Berg, an American civilian contractor in Iraq, is murdered by a group allegedly linked to al Qaeda and a video of his beheading. Goes live on the Internet. 

He was a telecommunications equipment contractor from Westchester and he travelled to Iraq in search of work opportunities. He was captured by Islamic militants in Baghdad in early April 2004. He was reportedly attempting to leave the country but was detained by members of the insurgent group. Jamaat al Tawhid wild jihad. Which later became part of Al Qaida in Iraq. 

There is no justification. For the brutal execution. Of Nicholas Burr. No justification whatsoever. The actions of the terrorists. You executed this man. Remind us of the. Nature of the. Few people who want to stop the advance of freedom in Iraq. Their intention is to. Shake our will. 

That, or classic Bush. I feel like, though judging by his tone of voice and I'm this is pure speculation, he may have actually seen that video before he did that press conference and I don't know if I I saw the video and it's I've never seen. Anything like that? It was one of those things that you cannot Unsee. But for I don't even know. I mean, I was young and stupid and it's. 

Hmm. 

Like yeah, like ohh. 

I think we were at the radio station and I think because it was across the news and we were working in the media, I think I think most of us that work. 

Yeah. This is on the Internet. 

They're kind of watched it as because that's. 

And look, I know this this might sound crass, but it was like, holy ****, they've just beheaded somebody, live on the Internet. 

Part of understanding what's going on. 

Hmm. 

It was just horrendous and like you like, I can still visualise it. It's just something that just stays with you. It's absolutely terrifying. 

Yeah, it's. It was an incredibly ugly, messy thing, and it's it's it's one of those things where it reminds you. Of just how frail we are, it's like it's very easy to end somebody's life. It was a a, a horrible, a horrible thing to have seen and kind of wish I didn't see it. But I did. Bergh family became very concerned after they didn't hear from him. 

Yeah. 

For several days. And a US State Department investigator actually looked into his disappearance and government inquiries at at had taken place, but they got no leads. They didn't. They couldn't find him. They just did not know where he was and his family got really frustrated because they said that the US government weren't taking enough action. So they hired a private investigator. They contacted their congressional delegation. Red Cross, just to find any information that they could and according to the Guardian it wasn't clear because he's a phone technician, so they don't know how he actually came to be kidnapped. Like he's not a high value. 

Hmm. 

He he's just a contractor working on the phone lines over. 

There. Yeah. And you wouldn't think that he'd be sort of travelling around in big groups and. Be. Identifiable and a target. 

No. 

So his body was found on the 8th of May 2004 on a Baghdad overpass by U.S. military patrol. His family were informed of his death two days later, on the 10th of May. And they stated to his family and publicly at the time that his body showed signs of trauma, but they didn't disclose that he'd been decapitated. 

That's right. Then on May 11, the website of the militant jihadist forum montada Al Ansar posted a video titled Abu Mussab Al Zarqawi slaughters an American infidel with his hands and promises Bush Moore. And that video shows Berg seated, facing the camera, his captors are standing behind him, also facing the camera. He's got an orange jumpsuit on, similar to the ones that prisoners wear, and he's captors all have masks on. They're all wearing balaclavas or or like scarves. And he identifies himself. He talks to the camera, he goes. My name's Nick Berg. My father's name is Michael. My mother's name is Suzanne. I have a brother and sister, David and Sarah. I live in Westchester, Pennsylvania, near Philadelphia. Here and then he does this whole statement and then they murder him. They cut his head off in front of the camera. And this is what his father had to say about it. 

Zarqawi killed my son, and he looked at him. Zarqawi felt my son's breath on his hand as he held the knife against his throat. So cow he had to look in his eyes. When when he did it, George Bush sits there, glassy eyed in his office with pieces of paper. And he condemns people to death. 

So that was actually a statement that he made some a couple of years later, but he was he was very angry, still very obviously distressed about what happened to his son and very angry about just the way George Bush was running the show. 

Hmm. And I think this was the one where. Where there was the opportunity to negotiate as well, I believe. 

Yeah, but they don't negotiate with terror. 

And I think that was also part of what his father was was alluding to in that statement as well. And that, yeah, I think they they wanted to do some sort of trade prisoner trade or something like that. I think that was in the days leading. 

Yes. 

Up to. It during the video there was a masked man who then read a statement after the killing and he said that this killing. 

Yeah. 

Was in revenge for the abuse that was occurring at Abu Ghraib and the torture and and everything that was going on. 

Yes. 

There. His death sparked outrage and condemnation global. Really. And it was the graphic nature of the video that that shocked the world. And again, you were like, gosh, this is real this this war is not over. 

Yeah. And why? Why is it still going and what are they doing over there like and you know it's not a. This isn't a military. This guy's a contractor. He's just a tradie. He's a tradie going over there to fixed phone line. It's like he's not a soldier. Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yes. 

Yeah. And it's showing that. The brutality of the conflict there. It also fueled debates about the ethics around disseminating such graphic content and, well, obviously, the terrorists are the ones that disseminated it. And it wasn't the first instance of violent content being spread on the Internet. It was probably one of the earliest examples of such graphic violence. Being widely circulated online. Mine. There were news reports about it, mentioning it, so driving people to search. 

Well, that was, I think that's that's sort of a big catalyst for it as well because you could find like the internet's the Wild West of these states. It's like all sorts of graphic stuff on there. It's fairly unregulated, but the fact that. 

For it. 

This. Content was a lead story in the main in the mainstream media and a lot of people had heard about that story in the mainstream media and then sort it out is what really brought things into question and made them think about how they want to regulate this sort of stuff. 

Yeah. 

Going forward. 

And it was also tricky for the media as well. Do does the mainstream media then actually discuss the fact that it was a video? Do they show still images from the video? Yeah. Do they even mention it? How? How do they, how do they report on this? So. 

And and that still happens now. Like there's so much censorship that happens by the time a story hits the mainstream media. So like another example, I can think of is the Boston Marathon bombing, which happens quite a few years after this. But a lot of people were tweeting photos from that. They were taking photos of. People like in all sorts of states of, you know, they, they, they, they, they had people with like their legs blown off and all that they were showing that on on Twitter they never aired that on the news but like the aftermath of that was extremely graphic and and part of me as as horrible as that is because. 

Hmm. Hmm. 

Like that person is in a pretty bad way, and they probably don't give people permission to be seen like that or have that image distributed. There needs to be some kind of discretion, you know, but they're also where is the line between discretion and making people understand what real like the gravity of what has happened, I guess. And there there is a real fine line and I think it's even worse. Now because. It's so, and I'll even draw an analogy of, you know, when you watch sport and somebody gets really badly injured, right, somebody gets really badly injured. It's in sport and certain TV networks will hang on that injured person. There was a really good example. 

Yeah, yeah. 

Where a player from the Canberra Raiders had a seizure. Like last year and the camera sort of honed in on them. And then they quickly kind of realised what was going on. But then all the players like stood around them to shield that person. And I don't know, like, I I don't know where the line should be drawn, and I definitely don't think that it's a great idea. 

Yeah, the teammates. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Go and watch somebody being beheaded by a terrorist because that basically fuels the intent of what they are trying to do, which is scared out of everybody. It's it's just. 

Yeah. 

Just. 

The but at the same time it's like. 

But this is the reality of going to war. This is what happens. It's yeah. And I think that's what the media it was. It was very new at at this point in time for something like that to be spread and for people to have access to it. Like even the Abu grave stuff that was. 

Understanding the gravity of the situation. 

That was on a disc that somebody found, whereas this is is there. So how do we how do we report on it? How do we share this and they and they were all really inconsistent. Some of them showed still shots of the perpetrators with the the hoods on. There was 1 media outlet. I think it was the Dallas Morning News and they actually showed the severed heads while another another one didn't publish anything saying that it does, like you say, plays into the hands of. 

Yeah, that's that's pretty cross I think even. 

The terrorists. 

Well, and it kind of does. But then I look at the the story that Pat Tillman's brother was telling last or a couple of weeks ago when he talks about the ID blowing up and people melting to the seats of the the vehicles that they're in when that happens. And unless they tell you about that, you don't know about it. I do. Free that it becomes sensationalised though, like and I I look at, you know, the way media outlets react now when there's a a crisis or a tragedy and and something might happen and the news network are outside the hospital where the people are and it's like what the are you doing at the hospital? There's you're not going to find out. 

Yeah. 

Anything more? By standing in front of the hospital filming the front door of the hospital, you're not in the room with the person. There's nothing you can do there. You. You're certainly not respecting their privacy. Like there's nothing that you can do or say out the front of the hospital that you could not do or say in the studio. It's like when they go to the memorials out the front of venues. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Where something tragic has happened. And they're like, ohh, and you can see all the flowers being added and, you know, and they do a headcount of the flowers. Like, here's how many bouquets of flowers. 

Or even the. 

Or even the trawling of people's social media accounts and. And once they once victims are named, they start putting up photos. And it's like you can't, like, they're just, they're just picking ones that suits the the story or the agenda. 

Are you now? 

Yeah. 

Ohh, that's revolting. And it's it's a straight cut paste, yeah. Yeah, it's a screen grab. 

Have you checked with with the next of kin with family and friends? Whether that's appropriate? It's just, yeah. 

So if if, like Nick, if Nick Berg was any kind of. 

Terrible. 

I guess, well, we didn't learn anything, did we? That's what it was. We didn't learn a thing because it became very sensationalised. It became very sensationalised. And, I mean, it's a shocking thing. Everybody shocked this. I mean, and if you're, if you're a news outlet that doesn't publish this. 

Hmm. 

Like, you're not gonna sell news. You're gonna be. You're gonna be one of the ones that are. Well, their fingers not on the pulse. They didn't even do the Nick Berg. 

Yeah. Story it also sparked a lot of discussions around centre censorship on the Internet as well. And how do you stop things like that being uploaded and shared? How can you? How can you regulate that and whose responsibility is it? Is it the platforms? Is it Internet companies? How do you how do you manage that? 

Yeah. 

And I I I don't think that's a question that to this day is answered. 

No. Well, I mean, the Internet is a haven for extremists, really isn't? 

Yeah. 

OK. Especially now, let's go to the 14th of May, where a a a very divisive character in the media, one Piers Morgan, which everyone would know these days for various, you know, he's always having some kind of hissy, fit and walking off set and putting something viral out there. But. 

Hmm. 

He was actually an editor of the Daily. Way back in 2004 and he was dismissed as the editor of The Daily Mirror after the newspaper published fake pictures of Iraqi prisoner abuse. 

They published photos showing British soldiers allegedly abusing Iraqi prisoners. The images depicted scenes of mistreatment, including soldiers urinating on hooded detainees and engaging in other acts of humiliation. So very similar. 

To the photos that. 

For the other great yes. 

Were released a few weeks earlier. Yeah, they were published in May. 2004 as soon as they were published, this triggered investigations by the British Government as well as media outlets. There were some inconsistencies and some discrepancies in the images which raised doubts about their authenticity and authorities also wanted to know is this what's going on? Because if it is, we need to find out and we need to stop it. They also got some independent experts to analyse the photos and from all of these investigations they determined that the. 

Yeah. 

Photos some had been digitally altered and some had been staged. 

I don't know that Photoshop. 2004 is maybe, maybe that's it. That's how they could tell. 

It would have been Ms Paint wouldn't. It. 

Hmm. 

Bit of word art. 

Yeah. 

Shouldn't put that word out circling around. 

Wrong one wrong font and the number plate of the vehicle. Something like that. The credibility of the image is obviously and the sources were absolutely called into questions which which led to the the revelation that they were. 

Faked. How's that? So say that you are with you're in the UK and you're with elite. Models, or Chadwick models, or whatever the modelling. Vacancies. 

Yeah. 

You know, you're not one of the preferred models. You're not like the hottest, but you're sort of an everyday man who's pretty rugged and you finally get the call up to be in a photo shoot. And you're like, this is gonna be. 

Yeah. Yeah. 

My big break. 

And the motivate is like, OK, so the motivation of this scene is you're a soldier and you've gotta go and take it on that Iraqi. Prisoner, imagine that. 

Imagine being the person in the staged photo. Yeah. Wouldn't you just say no? 

Yeah. 

Maybe I don't. I I don't. I look. 

Have so many questions. 

Well, with all due respect, I I understand that and I appreciate your questions. I don't think the Daily Mirror are are contracting models to be in the stage photo shoot. 

Many questions. 

Well, according to British sources, the photos were apparently taken in NW England. 

Yes. 

Wow. 

And once it was revealed, the mirror responded and said, Ooh, Whoopsie, we've fallen victim to a calculated malicious hoax. And we're very, very, very sorry that we published the photos. 

But hang on. Is that photos that they made themselves? 

They're saying that they didn't take the photo, so they didn't stage. They didn't hire the models and hire the room in northwest England. They would. They would give, they would give. 

I don't think. Hired models. Gee whiz, that soldier looks suspiciously like Jordan. 

They were given the photo so so a sauce gave them the photos and went, hey, look, look what I've found. This is going on. You better do something about it. So that's what they were saying. Like ohh golly. Ohh golly gosh. Somebody has given us these photos that we took in good faith and public. 

Yes. Somebody else states the photos and. Well. 

Wished, but they tricked. 

Well, Piers Morgan swears black and blue to this day that those photographs were not faked. 

Us. 

So. 

I got fired but I didn't believe half of the stuff that was being said about the but the the circumstances behind my departure I've never accepted necessarily those pictures were fate. They were brought to us by two soldiers in the Queen's Lancashire. Men who stood by them after the balloon went up on all the controversy, but more in. Currently, various soldiers from that regiment were later caught martialed and their own commanding officer went public and said his men have behaved like a pack of wild animals and we know the case of Bahamut USA. The hotel receptionist in Iraq who was tortured and murdered over a three day period by soldiers from that regiment. So I make no apology for exposing bad apples, and I say that as someone whose own. Family is steeped with. With army officers, no, it's not. It's. 

Ohh OK, so Piers told us it came from soldiers came from soldiers. 

Stuck to his guns? Yeah, stuck to his guns. Yes. Anyway, that was a pretty significant event in his career. Although I would say that it I don't know how much it affected. I mean, he's still a very big name in the media. He's a very polarising character. He's Piers Morgan. 

He is. He has a lot of run INS with the Royals, doesn't he? 

But I think again like the previous story, it does show the importance. 

Hmm. 

Of. Integrity. When you're a journalist and also. 

Hmm. 

And yes, having credible sources and and checking your. 

And justice, the responsibility that you have in verifying the accuracy of reporting. Now the sad thing is, is I think that that has devolved even further in this day and age. You don't, I reckon if you go on the Internet, you read a story, you gotta check it twice, 3-4 times. You don't know what's real and what is BS these days. 

Facts and all of that. I think it depends on where you're getting your information as well. I think it depends on who you choose to get. Do you get your information through social media or do you actively seek out? 

Hmm. 

Media like reputable media organisations, and do you get a balanced view from different media organisations? And the stuff with Princess Kate recently. How? How they? Yeah. How they they killed that immediately because there was evidence of photoshopping. So there are there there's obviously systems and controls in place at some of those more reputable media outlets. 

Ohh the doctored photos there. Yeah, but there there was. A story in that because the Royals that they gave them the photo so the royal family gave them. The photos and they doctored the photos to say, like in the hope that the media would leave them the alone while she was undergoing cancer treatment. It completely backfired. On them became a bigger story. 

But they've obviously got. The tools they've got the tools to detect if something has been altered and they do do those cheques. Yeah, not so much the way that they then reported on that after they discovered it. But yeah. 

Well, yes, yes. 

Yes. 

Yeah, yeah. I don't know, I went on Facebook the other day because I bought a bunch of. Shirts. And then I was getting pushed. Ads from scammers who said the shirts that I bought were on sale for $5. If you click this link and I was like. 

Motor. 

And they. But do you know what? Like, I know that sounds like dumb in comparison to what we're actually talking about, but it's kind of relevant because those people are. There's no one regulating that, right. Those people are paying for advertising that is not being vetted or scrutinised in any way shape or form. And a link that you click on. 

Hmm. 

We're just taking money. 

In that. Ad is taking you to a scam website where you're supposed to be able to buy a shirt that's worth about 80 or 90. Bucks for $5. 

Wasn't Doctor Carl selling you some magic? Pill the other day on. 

Deep fakes, all of that stuff and people are paying for ads with that like it's it's it's wildly unregulated at the moment. If anything, it's devolved beyond this. You know, as much as there are more tools to spot fakes. 

On Instagram. Yeah. Scary. 

There seems to be more fakes coming through and it's just like what? Like, what's your exit strategy? Well, you don't look at any of it. Just stay away from it. 

But you can't even look at your texts or answer your phone now because it's, you know, a robot calling to take all your money. The toll, the toll scam like I've always gone. I'm not paying that toll. But I did go. We did drive over a toll recently, and I'm worried that we haven't paid the toll, but I'm too scared to click on the link cause I. 

No. 

Don't. I don't know. You're the legit toll or. 

Not. I'm never paying it. I don't think we should pay any tolls anymore or parking, for that matter. 

So I just thought it was a scam, sorry. 

Exactly. Come all, you protect yourself. If in doubt, sport. 

I was going to say, you know, with those robot calls, saw a thing the other. 

Yeah. 

Day it was like we. 

Spent our childhood making prank calls like I used to ring the information line. 

Yeah. 

Is your refrigerator. Running. Yeah, you better go and catch it. 

Really, I used to pretend to do radio competitions. I used to do radio competitions and try and make people say. 

Stupid things, isn't it? Isn't it? Just a big socket that now we're getting pranked. Called by evil scammer robots. That's payback. 

No, I I I feel like that karma is incorrectly weighted, feel like that's not very fair at all. 

We didn't take anyone's money. 

No, that's exactly right. We just humiliated a few people and we're a bit annoying we're and now you're annoying and you're humiliated and broke. So it doesn't work out. So let's go over the sport, the Laureus World Sports Awards were held in the cultural centre of Berlin in Lisbon in Portugal. 

So good son. 

OK, sports. 

And it was a big deal. Michael Schumacher was the sportsman of the year. Annika Sorenstam was the Sportswoman of the Year, and the England men's national rugby union team, who were doing very well, unfortunately, were the team of the year. But the one that was particularly relevant to Australians was the world. 

Hmm. 

Action Sports Person of the year, which was one lane beachley. 

I only realised today that her last name has the word beach in it and she's there. I didn't. I never even noticed that. Isn't that nice? Do you think maybe she she pursued surfing because that was her last name? 

And. A surfer? Really. Really. I don't think that Beasley by name beatley by nature. No, I don't think so. I just think it was just one of those. 

It's just interesting. Like if my last name was Beachley, I'd probably pick a sport that had nothing to do with the beach just because I I would have felt that that's too obvious. 

Things. It's just one of those things. 

She's uh. 

She's married to Kirk Pengilly from INXS. 

That's right, she's lovely. I always like watching her in interviews. I. 

Yeah. 

She's pretty great. 

Think she's. 

And she is an absolute trailblazer. She was one of those women that was. 

Yeah. 

Hmm. 

In operating in a sport completely dominated by men and became a world champion, I mean sport, you know, it's surfing. Ohh careful. That it's a pastime. I have like I just, it's because I'm. I've told you I'm jealous. I'm jealous of people who surf. 

It's dangerous and you've got to be fierce. 

And it's very scary. I hate waves. 

The ocean is a terrifying place and the surf the surfers are always out at the time. At the same time as the Sharks. 

Yes, sharks. 

Yes, but they're always so. 

Chill man as well. Yeah, they're never stressed. 

Yeah. Surface. Which? Well, well, maybe they just say when they because they when the time that they're in the ocean, they're just in a complete state of panic. So as soon as their feet hit the ground again, they're like, oh, man, this ain't so bad. 

Right. 

Is all good. What's the worst that could happen? Worse things happen at sea. I've said it before. Chris Jericho is dressed up as David Bowie singing the weekend song. Exactly. But she was coming up at a time where it was completely dominated by men and she very talented surfer. She was actually on. 

Staying the. 

Yeah. 

There wasn't a lot of female. Surfers at that stage was there. 

I think it was the back page the Fox Sports panel show. So not just a couple of weeks ago talking about her experience in the early 2000s as a surfer. 

There was so many times where you know when something happens or someone says something and you just stop and. Go wait did that. Just did they just say that? Did that just happen? And we're still seeing it today, but it's probably not as overt as it was when I was on tour, you know? Was that classic cliche of it seems. It turns to ****. Send the girls out and that's what happened. You know, the minute the condition. And just turn to be abysmal. Like alright, girl. Off you go. It was 2002. It was such a pivotal moment because I was. I was world champion. I was competing in events and I was also the Director of the Women's Tour and I was representing the women's tour at the beach, basically fighting for the right to compete in certain conditions. And we almost lost the battle. Where we had decided, OK, we're gonna surf this morning, then the the guys will surf after us and then we'll surf for the rest of the afternoon when the waves will improve the title. Come in. Everything will get better. And then the guys protested because the waves were starting to get too good for us. And they stormed the judges tower and they pro. 

Ohh. 

Tested and for once we banded together and we stood up and we fought against it and we won that day and then we got to surf the best conditions that were on offer. And the guy sat back and went, wow, that's the best we've ever seen. You surf. We're like dirt. Like, that was the best surf we've got the surfing. 

Yeah. 

Well, good honour. 

And you know, that's a unisex award. The World Action Sports Person of the year Layne Beachley. So the in a field of guys and girls way back on the 10th of May 2004, Layne Beachley our lane Beachley. 

Yes, good honour. 

Who is taking part in the recreational activity of surfing? 

Oh. 

I just I'm. 

Just jealous. That's all it is. I'm really jealous. 

You need a shell necklace. 

Another recreational activity listening to music. I thoroughly enjoy it when it's right. 

Hmm. 

Well, we've got. 

A new number one here in Australia and sorry, it's going to be stuck in. Your head for another week. 

And I wonder if. 

You knew how it really feels to be when it's cold out here. Well, maybe you should know just fields to be left alone to be outside. Waiting for you to bring up. 

I. 

Anastasia. 

I don't like the way she says Fairy fairy is that the is that the way they say fairies in that show we watched with Carl, Carl, the Delvene girl. 

Fearing fear and fail. Ohh, that show with Orlando Bloom. 

Because the fairy, that word, that word fairy is spelled spelled differently fairy. 

Theory. Now they like fail like theory. The fairy tale. Yeah, I don't know. I think that's how they say it in in New Zealand, the. Fairy tale, yeah. 

You I I can't unhear the AI Jack Black version of that since you played it a few weeks ago, it was good. 

I know. I know, right? Yeah, I nearly accidentally put that version in the. But I didn't. 

Maybe, maybe we could another time if it's still number. 

One next time. 

Yes. Well, number one in the UK is this fella. 

What I said now the present might as well. 

It's. 

I don't want you back what I said. 

Might just. Shut up and enjoy your pizza. 

Do you think he's on cameo? 

Amon Amon on cameo now he's too angry if he is. If he see this I we're going down a rabbit hole. I don't wanna spend money on this. Well Jake won't gone. We've put Jake Horn to bed. He's out of the charts. He didn't message us or or did he? But he did. But I don't. I don't think that. 

Here we go again. 

Yes. 

No. 

I can do this again. I've been hurt before. 

It's alright. 

OK. And you know. What? 

Yeah. I wonder if you know. 

Yes, yes, I do. I do. That's how I felt for the. 

Yeah. When Jake Bond doesn't reply to you, that's what happens all my life. 

Last six weeks. 

There's no aim on, but there's eaten good with Freddie Jean. What? I think she'll reply. 

What is? That's not a celebrity. Well, that's. 

What came up when I typed in Amon? 

That person looks like a character from the. 

Muppets there's no reviews. 

I'm not surprised. 

At $25 Australian for a video. 

Of what? 

From eating good with Freddie Jane. 

That. Yes, I'm not paying $25 for. 

That. 

We'll actually get a reply though anyway. 

Yeah, you probably would. Maybe we should just. So we can have something to play on the podcast. You know what? We do that and then they'll be like, oh, you're a commercial entity. And we're like, we're really not. We have no money. And then they sue us, you know, and. 

That will cost you $20,000, yes. 

Then all of. A sudden Freddie Jean will be eating good cause. We'll be paying for it. So let's let's move. Move along. 

OK. Well, let's go to the US charts. But look, no jaquan sauce. 

Size. 

You say goodbye too many. 

Dream. 

So many hours I'm still burning. 

Let it go. 

If you're playing me, keep it on the low 1. 

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Yes. 

Yes. 

That's really boring. It's really boring. Maroon 5 are back in the charts at #5 with this love. Bye. Yeah, maroon. Whatever you wanna call Beyoncé. Naughty girl. #4 burn numbers. Just very. I don't wanna know. Two. Yeah. #1. 

Marine. Right. A bit more enthusiasm. 

And I'm over it. I'm sick of it. Let's do this. 

Get. 

Well done. 

Yeah, that's better. 

Ohh, that sounds like Smirnoff Black and a good night. At the UC for factory. 

It was a few Smirnoff blacks and a great night at the UC refectory that is a new album, Fantastic Album, a Breakthrough album. In fact, for the band Kill Switch, engage and that was the the the title track of the album, the end of heartache. Their third studio album, the 1st to feature lead. Vocalist Howard Jones and drummer Justin Foley. Jesse Leech had left the band at this stage still remained very good friends with them, but just couldn't cope with the touring schedule and had to deal with some personal stuff so they bought Howard in who was just amazing. Such a great vocalist. It peaked at #21 on the Billboard 239 on the Australian album charts. Just. Pretty good, good metal album. Went to #2 on the UK's rock and metal album charts. They're a bit more savvy in the UK with their rock and metal, and it was certified gold in 2007. They had a whole bunch of songs on there like set this world ablaze. 

Scrubs. Yeah. 

And then. 

They had the other song. When darkness falls that appeared on the soundtrack to Freddy versus Jason in 2003, they're doing pretty well when they when they made they made the Top 40 in Australia. After a really successful. Tour with anthrax and you know what's funny about that tour with anthrax? And I was gonna go and see him. And I never did because I had to work. And then I remember my friends Ray and Matt telling me that they were at the airport bar drinking fear with anthrax. Really. 

Ohh they that's right. Yes, I remember. Yes, you were very sad about that. That would have been a great concert. Those two bands, yeah. 

Very, very sad. Anthrax and Killswitch Engage with them. Fabulous. It won the best album at the 2004. Metal hammer Golden gods awards. Title track was nominated for Best Metal Performance at the Grammys that year as well. It was just great. It's such a good album. It's I really and I still love it to this day and I still love Killswitch Engage. They've had a few line-up changes, their original vocalist Jesse is back in the band and Howard is off doing other things, but he does a side project with Adam, did Adam Dutkiewicz the one of the guitarists. 

Hmm. 

That's not you. 

And the producers? 

Ohh, she's fine, isn't he? 

And then he's hilarious, and I cannot wait to see them supporting Iron Maiden later this year, which is awesome. 

Yes. 

Now a very interesting tidbit about Killswitch Engage, which I just love you, and we've seen them live. MMM. You know how much fun they are. 

They are so much fun and I'm glad you stopped me from trying to catch Howard when he staged UPS that night. That was a very poor decision on my behalf, so I'm glad that you moved me out of the way. 

They are hilarious. 

That one. 

We we had a fantastic evening seeing Killswitch Engage at the University of Canberra and it was a Wednesday. 

It was so good. 

Yeah, we had to go to. Work the next day. 

And we had to go to work the next day and we had. 

A lot of. 

Drink that we I am. 

Wasn't a very good. 

Day at work, I think I slept under my desk. 

You walked to work. I took your car. 

Yes. 

Ah. 

Hmm. And I had to go outside and sleep in your car in the middle of the day. And it was summer time, and I nearly died in your. 

God. 

Not in the pulsar. You never smell out. 

Yes, yes, I did. The smell of my corpse. No, no, it was it was a bit nasty. It was a fantastic night, though. A great band though. 

That's a good night. Good night. Good times. Good time. Who was the support act? And then someone introduced us to them and then they didn't care. 

Who we were they. What were they called? Divine heresies. But the singer for that band ended up singing for another band called Bad Wolves, who had some chart success with the cover of. 

That's right. They would love me. 

The cranberries. Zombie. In the charts. Yeah. What's this? What was the singer's name? Tommy. Vexed. 

Oh, I love that song. That would be good. 

I think you met him. We both met him. 

That's right. Yes, we met him and someone introduced us and they told him when they told him that we cause we weren't, we'd stopped working at the radio station then. But somebody who was also in the audience recognised us from radio days. 

Like you've got to meet. 

Yeah. 

Yes. 

And thought that that was interesting and a big deal and then introduced us as people on the radio to that guy and he was just. 

Yes. 

Like then what? 

Yeah. 

And we were like. 

Not how far we didn't. 

Well, you know what? 

Want him to disclose this? This is awkward for us too. 

We were kind of like so and what as well if the feeling was mutual. 

Oh no, I was excited. 

And then I remember seeing him singing that cover of the cranberry song. And I was like, oh, that's that dude that we didn't really care about at the University of Canberra. 

It was indifference towards us and we are indifferent towards him. I was excited. Awkward. Good on him. 

Anyway, another fun fact about kill switching age, which I think you'll find very interesting is Adam Duckwitz, the guitarist, producer from that band is a very funny. The guy you will often see him wearing Daisy Dukes and running around on the stage in in weird outfits and. 

He's the one that wears the. Short shorts. Hmm. He's very energetic, isn't he? He brings a lot. 

Just. 

Yes, and generally heckling the crowd and kind of being quite offensive. He's a very eccentric man. He won the showcase on the US version of the price is right. He won the showcase on the US version of the price is right and the funniest thing about that was. He wasn't allowed to tell anyone that he went on it until it aired on the TV, so he was telling his band mates. You have to watch the price is right and and Jesse, who's now back in the band, actually tells the story of what he saw. 

They're like what? 

And then he's like, hey, you should watch the prices, right tomorrow morning. And I was like, why would I watch this right? Like, it's on every day on tour. Like, I don't. I get tired of watching it and. I was like. Just and sure enough, he went on to win the whole thing. My wife and I are. On the couch at my. House. Like what? What the Hell's happening? 

$32,836 you beat her by a. 

101 dollars. 

Ohh my God. 

We won't buy 100 Watt bucks, but man. 

That was plus first. This is insane. 

That's hilarious. 

He wouldn't. He would just be the perfect contestant to have as well. Like he would be his energetic jumping up and down and grab you, grab you and hug you and kiss you, and he'd make the promo, even if he didn't win, he's. 

I'm very excited. 

There is. 

There was Drew Carey. 

Just. 

He's just the ideal contestant. 

Drew Carey, who hosts the prices right there, is actually a point in that show and I've watched the whole episode where Adam Dee wins the prices right. And he goes, he's the perfect prices, right? Yes. 

What did he win? What was the big prize in? 

The showcase, who won the whole. 

The. Show case. But you know how the showcase. 

Thing. Won the. 

Always has one big wow. 

Well, he won a car. He won the car. I think it was like, but it was like a Honda Jazz or something. And he and he, he won all of it. But then he had to pay tax through the toll on all of it in America. Yeah. And, you know, it's really interesting when we look at these bands like that we we put up on pedestals in this country. 

You think ohh. 

Ohh really? 

Well, you'd think they'd be millionaires. 

Well, no, they're not. Like, you know, they're they're working and they're earning an income and they're able to support themselves. But you look at bands like Killswitch Engage. Even Lamb of God, who you consider like top tier bands and they make a decent salary, they make probably what the equivalent is of an executive salary, but they don't make millions. They might be, if they're lucky on, you know, around 100 grand a year each. You know, they've got enough to pay off their mortgage. 

Hmm. 

Will continue their mortgage payments and and manage a car and put their kids through school and all that sort of stuff. They gotta keep walking. 

They still got a. 

Tour like that is such hard work. 

I remember touring with some bands from the states. Who hadn't quite made it yet, but had come over to Australia on like, you know, just. Not a whim, but like a promoter, had bought him out there, like paid him out, you know, paid them to come out here. And it's like, what do you do when you're not playing music and they're like paint houses, you know, construction, you know, things like that to make ends meet. I work in a video store. Wait tables. 

Kind of like actors, isn't it? Yeah, hospitality. 

Yeah. 

Like they're just doing whatever they can until they get their big break because like, creative. That that's the only way they can support themselves, you know. So it's. That's the sad thing about it all. But but at the same time, you know, at least they're pretty down to Earth still. And at least they make great albums and at least you can go and meet the singer at bad Wolves, even though he does a cranberries cover and you don't give about it at the UC par. 

Go, go. 

Right. 

It's not a B side from kill switching gates, no. 

It's and it's not the heavy metal cranberries. 

No, that is Eurovision. Ohh isn't that Eurovision if that's. If that doesn't scream Eurovision. I don't know what does. 

Change of pace now, yes. That is the winner of the 49th Eurovision Song Contest. 

It is the song wild dances by Ruslana who Co wrote it with her husband Alexander. 

Ohh. 

Often north of. 

Sign off, not off. It's enough to turn off enough. 

Off. 

Synovus synova tov. 

Synovus zov. That's very romantic. Well, Dad, so that's the that's the winner. She was from the Ukraine. So Ukraine won that year. 

Yes. What I said while dancers. 

Hmm. 

We had 30. 

Six countries participating, which is the highest number of countries to date as at 2004. 

Yes, and and and it was the 49th Eurovision Song Contest. So you know what happened next year. 

I already said that. 

Ohh the 50th. That's gonna be a big year, so it'll be. It'll be hosted in Ukraine for the 50th. 

Yeah, yeah, I know. You already said that. I'm just. I'm just trying to get you excited for the 50th. 

Because. 

The rule is if you win, yeah, then the next year it's hosted. In your country. 

Well, well, so and this one, this one was held in Istanbul in Turkey because Turkey won at 2003 with the song every way that I can by Sir Tab earner. 

Yes. 

2. 48th. 

The way that I like it, I'll try to make it. 

I'll give you all my love. 

Now. 

That's very Holly Valance. 

I was just about to say exactly the same. I'm like I could. I could see Holly Valance's management just going. I reckon we could make this sing this song. 

That was kiss kiss for a second. 

Just just wait till Scott. 

Yeah, yeah. 

'S at the tanning conference and come and sing. This. 

Yeah, she'd steal that Turkish music any day. Holly Valance? No, she's too busy these days. Like mouthing off about Greta Thornburg or some. 

That is so that is so. Ohh, who does she hate? Ohh yeah, that was just nasty, wasn't it? 

Yeah. Yeah, it's like, sorry, Holly. Who were you? Yeah. OK, alright, so there you go every. 

It's candy now, isn't it? Holly candy. She married the businessman with the last name Candy. 

Is it? I don't care, Andy. She's not at Eurovision and you know, and she's not doing anything every way that she can. Like sort of tab and her. 

No. 

She. 

So there you go. 

Well, so time earner had a little bit of a drama. So Sir Tab had to give the trophy. And she went up to give the trophy to to the Ukraine winner and her shoe got stuck in a speaker grill by the side of the stage and the stage hands had to free her. So it's quite it was quite a tense moment for a little bit. They had to free her. That's true. Yes, she got stuck. So they had to free her before she could hand over the award. 

Well, it's the passing of the torch, right? 

Oh. 

As she was wedged. It's got it's got wedged in the wedge. Yeah. Wow. Well, that's is that is that kind of metaphorical. I don't think Turkey was an under any political. 

Maybe she wanted to keep the, or maybe she wanted. 

Turmoil or anything like that, yeah. 

I don't know. 

But do you think? 

Too, because if you win, then you've gotta host it the next year. Do you think? Do you think when she won like the Ukraine government was like? 

Right. 

Now we've gotta host it. Next year, we've gotta get. 

Yeah. How are we gonna afford Eurovision? We've got enough problems. 

Gonna do the vineyard kator and have decorations. Yeah. Could have people filming it. This is I don't have. 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Yeah. 

The energy. So yeah, yeah. 

For Eurovision, well, I think couldn't you just like book an auditorium? You know, away you go. 

I don't know. I I'd be pleased if I was the government in my country 1 like, no, I don't want. I don't want a part of that. 

I just wonder what that I wonder what that I wonder what the bare minimum is for Eurovision. Like could you just get coast? 

The OR the MVP? 

To. Coast. Just get coast to coast to Golden roast to do the catering. Do you know what I mean? Well, that's your bare minimum for that. Like. 

Can you set up a marquee in a park? 

Yeah, just get like get like Mobi disc. Do you know what I mean? Just look. Yeah. Set up a marquee, mobi disc coast to coast to golden roast. You know, cap it at like, exactly. Of course you would coast to coast of golden roast. 

I love my business. I know that would be a good. 

Time be very good time. You set up a get the karaoke, who does karaoke? 

Umm, it's your vision, it's all karaoke. 

Set up the, set up the karaoke for them to yeah for the speakers. 

You don't wanna look, I I, I dare say if you put karaoke on as pre Eurovision entertainment you would be in real danger of upstaging some of the performers from some of the countries. 

Saving. Well, I think that's part of the fun. Let's have a listen to last place, which I think they got. It did not finish. I think they scored zero. Because they didn't. Turn up to the finals, or so I don't. 

Ohh really right. 

Know I don't know the true. 

Story they got zero. They didn't finish Switzerland. 

This is, yeah, Piero. And the music stars with their song celebrate. 

Yeah, right. 

Everybody just laughing. Have a wonderful time. Celebrate. Celebrate. Everybody. Celebrate. Celebrate, celebrate. After. 

Not really putting your best foot forward there. Switzerland. If I do so. 

That's it sounds like a. Live performance of a children's band. 

There is at one stage in that performance where he's like, celebrate or celebrating. And he hits himself in the face with his own microphone while he's singing. 

Gets the microphone. 

Well, maybe that's why they didn't finish. Maybe you got a concussion or something. Yeah. Yes. I'm sorry. I'm not going back on stage with the chip, too. I don't care if it's coast to coast. 

Yeah, Piero, I think he chipped his. Tooth. Yeah, on the microphone. 

Catering. I'm not going back out there with. 

This tooth. Why? I mean, you know, come for Eurovision, stay for the potato salad. 

It's very good potatoes salad. 

They're potato salad is they're potato. Salad is looking amazing. 

And. 

They they do a pasta salad as well so. Pasta salad right now. 

Yeah, the the Cubs in my life. 

Hungry. 

Everybody just got. Have a wonderful time celebrate. Everybody will celebrate. 

Place. 

It's entertainment time, as if Eurovision wasn't entertaining enough. 

Yes. 

Ah, it is. 

I know. And the catering on fleek. 

Out of this world. 

Number one in the US box office this week is Van Helsing. 

My life, my job, my curse. 

Is to Vanquish evil. 

We need you to go to the east, to the far side of Romania, a land that is home to legendary creatures. 

I see the wolf man hasn't killed you yet. 

Don't worry, he's getting to it. 

Lord, that over by Count Dracula. 

It is a place where nightmares come to life. 

And helsing. 

Hey. 

He's the first one to kill a vampire in over 100 years. I'd say that. Send him a drink. 

Now, a man without a past. 

Do you have any family Mr van Hersey? 

I hope to find. 

Out someday, it's what keeps me going. 

Will face an enemy that never dies. In 1462, Dracula was banished to an icy fortress. 

And then the devil gave him wings. 

And uncover a secret he never imagined Dracula. Hello, Gabriel. 

We have such history, you and I. 

That is such a terrible movie. 

I thought he was. 

The party liaison. 

Who? Van helsing. 

And Nelson, isn't he Ryan Reynolds party Liane? 

No, that's van Waldo. That's van Wilder. Different van? Yeah. Different band. Yeah. Next thing you'd be like on Toyota Tarago. That's also a different van. Van Helsing is the the the the vampire hunter Van Helsing. 

Wrong. Wrong. Got my vans models. 

OK. 

Horror, horror. No parties. 

Ohh, is that Dracula? 

This guy that hunted Dracula. Yes. OK. Yes. But this is like a modern take on it. 2004 Action horror film written, written and directed by Steve. It's almost it was just like it's it's got Hugh Jackman in it, slipping in and out of just the most hideous Dutch accent I've ever heard in my life. I'm like, what are you doing? And Kate Beckinsale is in there as Anna Valerious. So this is supposed to be this homage and tribute to the universal monsters. You know the wolf man's in there and draculas. 

In there, OK. 

Yeah, from the 30s and 40s like summers the the director and writers, a massive fan. And it's obviously inspired by Van Helsing. Thing from the the novel Dracula. The critics hated it. They gave it 24%. The audience lapped it up a little bit. They gave it 57%. But I'd argue it was pretty lowest common denominator. Was I wanted this to be good and I knew it wouldn't. Be and I was correct. The bad movie it's a bad movie. It's a in fact, and I'm not the only person he's a critic for you, Joe Laden. From the moving picture show, a chaotic blur of recycled archetypes from classic horror flicks, action sequences unbound by laws of gravity and physics, and CGI special effects somehow managed to appear ridiculously expensive and unconvincingly obvious. 

All at. 

Months. And how's the dialogue? Do you hear the dialogue in the trailer? Yeah. It's castle Dracula. Ohh, great. You know what is this something that I don't know? Anyway, it doesn't matter. 

It's weird. You. Jackman, you. Would have thought it would be. A bit better. 

No, Hugh Jackman just wanted to get paid. So he's like, yeah, cool. I'll be Van Helsing. 

Well, it was #1 at the US and Australian boxer got to go see Wolverine. Yeah, being the Dracula. 

Yeah, cause, let's see, Jackman. I've gotta support our hue. Yeah ohh this is was this. This was after he did like an X-Men Movie. So he was kind of, I think so, yes. 

Things. 

Was it OK? Well, we we always love you. We're. Supporting you and. 

I love you too. Especially with those bangs, let's go to TV's 18 years, 18 years. Margaret and David were on air on the SBS as. Part of the. 

On VSPS. 

Movie show on the SBS, the Soccer broadcasting station, the sex before soccer channel the SBS. Yeah. What is, what does it actually stand for? Is it special broadcasting service? 

Yeah. 

Well, then it's the special broadcasting service. 

It just sounded weird that you put a the in front of it. I it just it. 

Yeah, I know it makes me it ages me. It makes me sound old. 

It was jarring. It was jarring. Like the Facebook. Yeah, it's jarring. Can you not do it? 

Yeah, it makes me sound old. The interwebs. The wireless. 

Please don't do that again. 

Yeah. David and Margaret resigned from the movie show. They're like, we quit. They're like Margaret and David. You're fired. They're like, no way we quit. 

Pace out. Comrades and Stratton outs. Outs. 

Out which and the movie show was awesome, and Margaret and David. 

Yeah, so good. 

Still are awesome. I love Margaret Pomerance and David Stratton. I think they are the some of the just. They were a fantastic duo. They had amazing chemistry together that you can't manufacture and they are also very polarising with their movie reviews. They never got on. 

Yeah. I love it when they. 

Yes. 

Argue that was ohh that was. Always good, wasn't it? 

Yes, yes, like David who absolutely hated the castle. 

It's a simple first effort from the frontline team, shot in a very short space of time, but for me it was a winner. 

Well, I'm afraid it wasn't for. Me, Margaret. I I. Really didn't get on to the wavelengths of this film at all. I thought it was patronising towards its characters. I didn't find it funny. It reminded me of the sort of humour that I thought had gone out with Dad and Dave 60 years ago. 

Well, it's nice to know it's still around. I think it's a very Australian sort of humour. 

Well, that may be that may be. Maybe. Maybe I'm just not into that kind of humour because I I just didn't find it. Funny and and I'm. 

But it's. 

No matter whether you do make that breakthrough and think ohh no they they really like this this family. 

Yeah, I mean, I I just thought it was silly and and technically it really is. I mean you say it's rough, I mean it's very rough. 

I almost don't disagree with him. Now that I've heard his point of view. 

Hmm. 

I mean, you know it's it's, it's got like all of the sound bites and stuff. What is it? It is at its core, you know. It's just one of those movies. That's bunch of sound bites. 

Oh. Ohh, I don't think Margaret would appreciate that. 

It's a long. Time. No, she wouldn't. She wouldn't. So they left SBS and then went over to the ABC saying that they weren't happy with the the high level decisions that was happening at the SBS at the. 

I think she'd go you on that. 

Special broadcasting service. 

Yeah. And they started a new show over at the ABC. 

Yes. 

But the movies was basically the same show, wasn't it? Because then SBS kept it going on their channel, but then they got 4 presenters and the four. 

Same exactly the same. We are with the younger Kiefer. 

That they completely flipped the format because they have a DVD review segment they're trying to be cool and hip and it would. It didn't. I don't think it lasted very long for memory. 

No, they had Megan Spencer, who fanella kernel bone, Jamie Leonardo, and Mark Fennell, who Mark Fennell was big on Triple J, and I think he's gone on to do a lot of stuff on the ABC these days, actually. 

I know that name. Who's he? Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Doing and he finnell just did the DVD segment. 

Didn't we? 

Didn't we interview Margaret and David or one of them when they went over to the ABC? I'm pretty sure we didn't interview about the new show. 

Did with David? 

And I. Was was David and I was so nervous. I was so like it. It's one of those ones where you go. Oh my gosh, I've idolised. 

That was a big deal. Yeah, they were an institution. 

You for so long. Don't say anything dumb. Ohh my gosh. 

And he was still. 

Lovely. 

One of the nicest guys in the biz, such a nice guy. 

So lovely. Yeah, like Andrew Denton as well. I was so nervous to. 

Yeah, yeah. 

Speak to him. He was just gorgeous. 

And we're quite lucky living in Canberra because often he'll go to the film and sound archive and do a talk or something like that and he's he's a really great guy so they retired from at the movies actually for real. Like after all of this in 2014, they kept going on for quite some time and. 

All they had been say. One yeah. 

At their and yeah, this is their final show. 

Well, as you might have heard by now, we've reached the point where we're stepping down from our. Chairs. How can you step down from chairs? I think it would have been a lot better if one of us. Had just fallen off. 

Don't you? 

Reckon yes, we look, we've been doing this show for 28 years, more than 28 years. By the time we finish ten of those years at the ABC, it's been wonderful. We've had a marvellous time. We are so appreciative of. The support we've had from viewers all over the country. But we both feel that 28 years is enough and it's time to. 

Sort of. It's been an incredible run on television. Yeah, I mean, we've been enormously lucky and you know, our longevity is due to you guys. All you film lovers out there. So. Thank you so much for supporting us right from the very. Beginning. 

And keep going to. The movies, yes. 

They're just authentic. They're just real, you know, they're just that, that, that's sort of what they're not projecting anything. They're not trying to be anything. They're not. They're just themselves. And that's what I loved about them. Yeah. Yeah. And they. And they had such a great dynamic. And Margaret would always come on and she'd be like, hi, at the start of every show. 

They just love movies and they love talking that, yeah. 

Hi. 

The massive earrings and always, always conflicting point of. 

Yeah. 

Views you know, and she'd always dismissed because David would love an action movie and all that sort of stuff. And she'd always be panning that. But somewhere in the middle you'd always find something that you agreed with with both parties. 

Do you reckon they still hang out? Jerking? They meet up every now and then and chat movies. I'd like to think they do. 

I don't know. I don't know. Maybe they've had enough of each other after 28 years. Maybe after they were done fighting the SBS and they started fighting each other like, you know what? I think it's time. We start seeing other movies. You know what I mean? 

Yes, we did have another end of an era on TV over in the US 13th of May. The final episode of Frasier on the NBC airs, watched by 33 million people. Were you a Frasier fan? 

Nope, Nope, never saw it. 

All I remember as a dog, there was a dog. I don't know if it was his. I thought he hated dogs. There was a dog there. 

Yeah. 

Wasn't it? It was a speech of it was a spin off of cheese, wasn't it? Yeah. 

Was a. 

Dog Russells it was, yes. 

So what's cheers? 

You watched this? Well, then maybe you should have watched Frasier. He's a psychiatrist, Kelsey. Grammar it is. We should clarify. And I think the show revolves around he does a radio show called the Doctor Frasier Crane Show, and People can call in looking for psychiatric help. That sounds like a great idea. 

Yeah, cheers was great. It was just a spin off. It's just. Uh-huh. Yeah. That's right. 

Yeah. 

Yes. And then, yeah, yeah, the well, I'd, I'd listen. I'd be very interested. Yeah, I would. I'd be like hey. 

The lines are open all now put you on air. 

Hmm. 

I've been having these delusions about hosting Eurovision and getting coast to coast to Golden Roast to cater it. 

Frasier got a great. 

Idea. Yeah. Do it. Tell me more about this. 

I don't think you need any help here. I think you you already know what. 

I think that I I know. I think you'd be like you're certifiably insane. And we're sending the authorities around to correct collect you? Yes. 

You need to do. Please invite me. I wanna bathe it. I want some of that. And salad, he reconnects with his father, passed his salad, too. Yeah, reconnects with his father and he ohh his younger brother Niles. I remember, Niles, I think I've ever watched it, but I've seen the. 

Ads. 

Seen yet over the course of 21 years. 

I think Niles is a psychiatrist. I've seen. I've seen Niles, and I've seen the dog. The dog was a Jack Russell, white haired Jack Russell. 

He has a beautiful dog, gorgeous dog. 

See. Yes, he jumped, jumped on the couch or something. I think Frasier got mad. 

And. 

I'm sure he got mad that he doesn't like dogs. 

The foundation and how long that the eleven seasons and that's all you remember. 

The dog and Niles the dog jumping on the couch. And there was some other people. Yeah, and there was a sports hotel coast who was on the station, who was also a friend. 

OK. Yeah. Yep. 

And so the last episode was. 

Called Good night Seattle. And you were supposed to get a grab of it, but you didn't. 

Yeah. I couldn't give about this show. I think this is this is a really terrible way to end the entertainment segment, but whatever. 

So instead. Entertaining. Would you like me to leave you with a an episode recap? 

Ohh yeah I would. 

In the form of haiku. 

Ohh yes, please keep it, keep it brief. 

You ready? Leaving Seattle, Sean Frazier starts anew with Glee. Embrace futures. Sheen. I thought you were going to press the applause button. 

Oh. 

No, we'll just move straight to books you didn't like my haiku. 

No, I just wanted to get straight into books. No, I thought your haiku was fine. 

What is it? 5 syllables 75 see here. 

Yeah. That's great. Yeah, you did it. You got it. It's OK. 

Oh. 

I don't know what it is. OK, alright, let's move on to books before anyone counts syllables. Sorry. Keeping you awake. We have a best seller and This is why you're yawning. It's non fiction. It's Rick. 

Dust. 

Books you didn't read. Are you getting? No, because I don't want to put my yawn. Ohh. I guess I'm putting my yawn in. OK, what is it? 

Yeah, your yawn can stay. We've got a yeah, we've got a non fiction because Davinci code still fiction. 

If people I don't wanna contribute to like driver fatigue, you know how when you yawn and then everyone else like just sit there then other people are gonna yawn as. 

Oh, when someone you want you. Make someone else your own. You need to do a yawn warning. 

Well so anyway. 

I don't think it's hearing a yawn. I think it's seeing a yawn, isn't it? I'm sure it's seeing a yawn. I think if no, you do a yawn, do a yawn. 

Really. 

I think it's just thinking that, you know, even thinking. 

Nut nut. I'm not yawning now. Do you wanna visually? 

Even even thinking about. 

Yeah. Now, now, what are you doing? See, it's seeing so it's fine. So nobody's gonna crash because they haven't seen you. Yeah, OK. Does your mouth opens wide? 

I've got a big mouth, all the benefit podcasting with my my, my dear, OK. Speaking of yours, what's this book we didn't read? Ohh yeah. 

Don't solo the microphone. Plan of attack, plan of attack. Very topical. It's a 2004 book by American author and investigative reporter Bob Woodward. And it's a definitive account of how and why Bush. And his allies launched a preemptive attack to topple Saddam and occupy Iraq. Are you gonna do a synopsis before? I read the whole. 

I suppose. Alright, let's get some music going. 

Story. Yeah, maybe you should. 

Woodworth wood this. 

Landmark account of Washington decision making provides an original, authoritative narrative of behind the scenes manoeuvring over 2 years, examining the causes and consequences of the most. Controversy was. Vietnam, based on interviews with 75 key participants in more than 3 1/2 hours of exclusive interviews with President Bush, plan of attack his part presidential history, charting the decision made during 16 critical months, part military history, revealing precise details of the evolution of top secret war planning under the restricted code word polo step. And part a harrowing spy story as the CIA dispatches a covert paramilitary team into northern Iraq six months before the start of the war. What emerges are astonish. The Internet portraits President Bush in more cabinet meetings in the White House situation room in the Oval Office and in private conversation. Dick Cheney, the focused and driven Vice president Colin Powell, the convicted in court, the Secretary of State, Donald Rumsfeld, the controlling war technocrat George Tenet, the activist CIA director. Toby Franks, the profane and demanding General Condoleezza Rice, the ever present referee and national security adviser, plan attack, provides new details on the intelligence assessments of Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction and the planning for the wars aftermaths. Thanks. It kind of, yeah, grew into something I did. 

That was a bit Harold from neighbours. Yeah, yeah. 

Ohh didn't. 

I need both few Harolds. 

I didn't really know where it was gonna. Go. But that's. 

Trumpety, you're a bit trumpet you. Sounded like a trumpet. 

Yes, I believe that's where it ended up. So carry on, yes. 

In the trumpet. Look, because it's because it's not. I always struggle on the good reads with nonfiction, with the room, and particularly particularly war books, because they are quite polarising and it's usually the reviews are usually based on people. 

Do views mine? 

Preferences political preferences so you don't get a lowest one stuff, for example. 

Yeah, yeah, there's a there's a swing to. It. No. 

So instead, Ben, two stars has summarised the book for us. So I think this is I think this is better than grabbing some of those polarising viewpoints on the non fiction. Instead we'll get a summary from Ben Tosta, but we're going to. Have to act it out. 

All right. 

So would you like to be booked? 

I'd love to be Bush. 

OK, you can be Bush. I'll be general Frank. You can also be Rumsfeld. I'll be tenant. 

Yeah, yeah. OK. 

And I'll be and then it will all be everybody else. Does that sound OK? So Ben, to start has summarised it. And he said the only reason the book didn't get one star. 

This is going to be hard. 

From. His point of view, obviously, was because the behind the scenes accounts were kind of interesting, but of course people present themselves in the best possible light. When interviewed. 

They absolutely do. 

The endless dialogue could have been summed up in one page start scene. 

OK, so this is it. 

You are Bush. 

What's our plan for Iraq? 

Long build up long war 18 to 24 months. 

Yes. 

Rumsfeld. 

Ohh so. General Franks long build up long war 18 to 24 months. 

Make it shorter. 

Franks, OK. 

What do we have on a rock? Intel. Sorry. That was Bush. In case you didn't. Know clearly, yeah. Tenant nothing Bush Saddam's crazy and may become a threat. They must have WMD's. Holy pluralised. Everybody else 1/2. 

No. Three, OK. Ohh pal, we didn't allocate. Can I be pal? Sure. We are going about. 

This the wrong way. 

Cheney we are totally doing this correctly. War is what we need. Everybody else 123 OK. Bush, where are we on our war plan? 

Franks, after many planning iterations, we have it down. To three. 

Bush. Perfect. See end. We're almost there, Mel. Thank goodness. It's the hatches, matches and dispatches segment. This week's clue alludes to a match a celebrity couple. Did they get married? Did they get married this time 20 years ago? Here's the clue. 

We got. 14th of May. 

It was perhaps half an hour or or so later that someone came up to me and said, do you know? Who these people? Are and said no? And then we found that. 

Now that was Mary Donaldson. So if you said Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark and Princess Mary. You. Could be correct. 

I love this story. I just love the fact. 

Do you? 

That she's out on the during the Sydney Olympics. 

Yeah, at the. Yeah. 

And she just. Starts chatting to some dude that she thinks is hot. No idea who he. Is and then someone comes up to a. Bit later going. Don't you know who? 

He is the first time that we met or she can, so I did not know who was the Crown Prince of Denmark. It was perhaps half an hour or. 

She. 

Or so later that someone came up to me and said, do you know who these people are and said no? And then we found out. 

Because there wasn't. I wasn't the only Crown Prince in that crowd that evening. So. 

Yeah, he wasn't the only crowd Prince in that crowd. Well, it's the Olympics. Everyone was here for the. 

Ohh say it could happen to anyone could it could happen to you could be at Mooseheads and you could. 

Olympics. That's a. 

Meet a Prince. A good place to. 

Pick up. Really. 

Could be the. Private bin. You could meet a Prince. Do you reckon? Who knows? This just shows you that dreams do come true when you can. Because you can become a Princess if you dream about it. Since you're a little. 

No, no. No. That's that. There is no way. There is an. An ocean of difference between. Being at the private bin and being in a corporate box at the Sydney Olympics. 

They weren't in a corporate box. They were in a pub. They're in a pub. That's what I said. That's why I love this story. She's at the pub. 

Ohh well. Ohh, they were too. And do you know what the pub was called? It says here in the notes the slip in. 

Maybe you should read the nights sleep in. 

That's your job. 

Yeah. So I do I. Love that story I love. 

It she's an Australian, she's at the pub and she's she's snatched a Prince. Good on her. 

It's a great start. 

She snatched the Prince at the slip in. 

Amazing. 

So she had no idea who he was until people came up to her. She heard there a bit later on, and then they had a long distance relationship after meeting and he made secret trips to Australia. She was. Tasmania wasn't. 

She was from tazzie, yeah. 

She. 

So he made secret trips to Tassie because no one could know. It was on the DL. And then, in 2001, she moved to Denmark. The relationship was announced, and then in 2003, they were officially engaged. 

Yeah. 

And weren't we just so proud? Our Mary look at our Mary. Look at our Mary. She's out on the turps, and she's snagged the Prince. And now she's getting married. She's gonna be a freaking. 

We were besotted, besotted with our Mary. 

Princess, this is great. And put Tassie on the map first. Reggie wins Big Brother and now our Mary's going to be. A Princess. 

Putting Tassie on the map as opposed to a a map of Tassie is is a good thing. Yeah you get back to more stories about Bush in Iraq. 

It's a good thing, good thing, very good thing. 

Anyway, that's another thing. 

Shortly after the engagement, she was quoted as saying. I don't recall wishing that one day I'd be a Princess. I wanted to be a veterinarian. 

Well, yeah, mean. 

I think she's working in real estate. The time. 

She's in real estate. Well, she certainly upgraded from real estate to be a Princess. 

Yeah. 

Well, it was quite the lavish affair, the wedding, the coast to coast, the Golden Rose were caterers. 

Yes. Yeah, yeah. Recently renovated and. Only one owner. 

Dignitaries around the world. There's a carriage procession through the streets of Copenhagen. 

Carpet matches the curtains? Yep. 

And people, people. 

Love her over there as well. They were proud of our Mary, but over there they love. They love our Mary as. Well. 

They do. 

Everyone was excited, catching a glimpse of them in the procession. Then they had a big reception at Fredericksburg. Palace. 

Why? 

Freedom. You gotta deal with the accent. You don't. You don't do characters. Notice that in the book thing, yeah. 

Friedensburg bridesburg palace. No, I don't. I don't do accents where I know I don't do this. Guests enjoy enjoyed a traditional Danish face, so it wasn't coast to coast, the Golden Roast. And there was dancing till late in. 

These danishes they had Danish. 

The night. They've got four children. Yeah. Christian, Isabella, Vincent and Josephine. 

They were very Danish names. 

Close knit family often seen participating in royal events public engagements. 

Together. But there's. 

Yes you do. 

Big news wasn't there earlier this year. 

Well. 

What's that? 

For them. 

So the. 

Maybe you should read the. Next paragraph, very big news. 

Ohh there yes, big news Margareth the 2nd announced her abdication as Queen of Denmark during her New Year's Eve address to the nation on the 31st of December in 2020. She's like, you know what? I'm done with this queen BS. I'm out of here. I'm retiring. She retired and she was succeeded. 

It's a bit of. A shock surprise no one saw that coming. 

I'm tired. I read that book and I need to sleep. 

By her elder son, King Frederick the 10th, on the 14th of January. That's Frederick. Yeah, Frederick the 10th. 

That's the guy. The guy that's Husby, yeah. So Mary is now a queen. 

So she's the queen of. 

Clean. 

From humble beginnings, clean real estate agent in Tasmania to the Queen of Denmark, that's a great story. That's a great story. 

Yas queen. So the yes. Yes. I love that. I love that story and I think one of her sons is a model like he's pretty good looking. Yeah, he's like a famous model. 

Really. 

Or something now. 

Yeah. Well, she's pretty good looking as well. Good DNA in that family. He's a good looking bloke as well. 

Yeah. Lovely story and it just gives us hope that one day you're getting loose at the moose and you. 

Excellent. 

Snag yourself a Prince. 

Well, hell, if she was in Tasmania she'd probably marry her brother, so that's great. That's excellent. Child would have had bloody 2 heads anyway. That's the end. Sorry. Apology. I just so you know, I did spend a couple of years in Tasmania in my childhood. I lived there for a couple of years, actually. One of the. 

OK, good. Probably are the best. 

That's where your attitudes will fall. 

It's actually one of the best places I've ever lived in in my entire. 

Good. Trampoline as the first. 

Time I went on a trampoline in. Tasmania good trampolines? But I got my toes stuck in it cause. One of the net. 

We come for the trampolines, stay for the people, wonderful people in Tasmania. I love Tasmania a lot. 

And the the hey diddle diddle did you go? To the hey diddle diddle. 

The cat and fiddle mole. 

We sat there. For like 2 hours waiting for that thing to go off. Very unpredictable. 

It was I I did. I did experience Pew to. Puberty while I was in Tasmania, so I hate it a little, quite a bit, but that's a story for another time. Ohh no no. 

I said I thought you meant that the clock. I'm like the clocks. That exciting. No, it was unpredictable. Like spring rolls. We sat there for hours waiting for it to diddle. And it didn't diddle for a while. 

The cat fell. Trust me, I diddled little one that mate. Anyway, that's the end of the show. 

OK, good. 

It will be back next week. We got anything lined? 

No, no I have. Prep yet we're just wouldn't turn up, yes. 

We'll figure it out when we get there. You know what else? Thank you. Thank you. One and all for joining us on this little journey. It's been a bit of a roller coaster this week from and, and this is the problem. I think with doing some of these really heavy news stories is. 

Yes. 

You just need to cut loose at the end of that. You just need to steal. I mean, in spite of all the atrocities and horrible things that happen in the world, we're all still above ground and we need to enjoy our lives and have a bit of fun and have a bit of a laugh, not necessarily at other people's expense, but generally generally at at maybe a small group or a minority. 

Yes. 

That would be rogue. 

They're. 

Probably a little bit. 

Spence. That's OK, isn't it? Well, not really anyway. 

Probably not. 

Right. 

But you know, we're not going to get fired because we're not being. Paid. 

No. Well, we could fire ourselves and maybe we should just for this evening. I think we're suspended until next week. You can find us on the socials, though. You can reach us to us there and send letters of sympathy and Amnesty team. Yes, indeed. No, please don't do that. Don't complain. I don't have time in my life for. 

So that's fine. 

Maybe. 

No complaints. 

Complaints I deal with so much on a day to day basis. This is where this is our happy place. This is where. 

OK. All right. No complaints. Stay high. 

We come to. Relax, set for t -, 20 podcast on the socials and just be kind. We love you. We appreciate you and we will see you next week. 

Thanks for taking the time to rewind. Join us next time for another week. That was 20 years ago. In the meantime, come and reminisce on the socials search for T -, 20 podcasts on Facebook, Instagram and TikTok.